Man, do I have something good for you guys today.

What I have for you today is an interview that I performed on camera with Father Peter Bowes. Father Peter is a Christian mystic. And if you don’t know what Christian Mysticism is, you’re going to learn in this interview because I ask a number of 50,000 foot view questions about Christian Mysticism, etcetera and how Christianity actually matches and is congruent with southern Easter traditions, Buddhism, Sufism, Kabballah to a certain extent, etcetera.

We discussed spirituality and a little about his organization as well, which is in five different cities across America now. It is a Christian Mystic movement. So, new Christians probably interested in watching this and learning more about enlightenment from a Christian perspective. Because that’s what this group is all about—discovering the divinity within Jesus actually taught about and speaks about throughout the entire New Testament and especially in the gospels.

So, please enjoy this. Two items of note: one, I apologize on the lens flare on Father Peter’s camera later in the interview; I just kind of set these cameras up and let them go and didn’t realize that the lens flare was green. Second, look behind Father Peter out the window. In December, there are some beautiful flowers out there right behind this man. And I am wondering if his energy had something to do with that. Who knows?

Anyways, here we go with the interview with Christian Mystic, Father Peter Bowes.

SW: Well, Thank you for this time today. I really appreciate sitting down with you because I just wanted to seek the opportunity because you’re travelling a lot and not always in Charlotte. But I wanted to seek the opportunity and sit with you and discuss some of the aspects about what I call and what other people call, Christ’s consciousness or being awaken about everything. Because you guys have, from my perspective, a really cool spin on Christianity and that I think it is more accurate to Jesus’ actual teachings. For the folks who don’t know anything about Christian Mysticism or anything about your church or your organization and things like that, let’s start with some basics and maybe we can discuss and tell me a little about Christian Mysticism from a 50,000 foot view. What’s that all about?

FPB: Well, the mystics are ones that are more the experiential ones. They’re looking for an actual inner experience of God or Christ or the universal life force and they’re not interested on the head knowledge-thing where they like learning thing, reading about it—they want to actually have something happen to them in their meditations or in their devotions, in their prayers, in their practice. It’s more life-changing. So, more real; not so conditional or speculative.

SW: Right. So would say is those folks were reaching out for an actual experience of God? Something that’s like they can grasp unto, that’s tangible?

FPB: Yeah, I think those are the people that we work with. The ones that want something to happen and not just have the theological idea of floating around your head. We’re not really into ideas because that’s just theory. It’s not practice.

SW: Right. It’s like managing the mind, learning how to be a follower of Christ. That’s everything?

FPB: Looks like discussing what love is as if it’s a theory. Like if love happens to you what would it feel like and speculating what that would be like and that’s not the same as it’s happening to you.

SW: Right. Excellent. Now, how many organizations you have? Like how many—here in Charlotte?

FPB: In Charlotte, yeah we have five centers right now: in Boston, Oakland, Chicago and Seattle. So, we have priest center that teach in those centers. I travel around to those.

SW: Okay. How would you say from the folks who’ve had an experience? Like I used to grow up—I stumbled to this thing that I called ‘my emit.’ It was basically an awakening that was brought unto meditation. I was reading a book about Zen Buddha and by D.T. Suzuki and all I understood about it before I stumbled into it was there’s this thing called a satori and the satori is this grand awakening to everything that is and the reality of the universe. And to get there, the Zen Buddhism believes that you clear your mind of all thought and then it will come to you. That’s the kind of experience that I go into. You know, I am not a Zen Buddhist. I’ve read that when I was filling my mind with a bunch of ideas and things that got totally blown away but my background before that was—you know, Palestine Christian. I grew up in a Methodist church and I was president by the church’s group for six years running and I read the bible. I knew everything about it and thought I have a good relationship with God. I was talking to God and I was kind of almost hearing a directive voice in my was kind of directing my life on what to do. And then, all of that got blown away and I truly understood what this being “born again” is actually all about–this coming out from my old self into this new consciousness. How would you explain what you guys do as a difference? Or what is the difference on what you guys are teaching in comparison to what other Christian churches teach and that type of thing?

FPB: We’re teaching that’s something that’s deeper than mind and way deeper than emotions. That’s the problem because most people can rehearse, practice and read and then regurgitate. They can even tell themselves many things that are still true from the scriptures. You can read them and know them and repeat them and still no change. Or you can have—you can froth up with emotions, you know a lot of care advice would do that. There would be like tremendous emotions, a lot power, moving spirit, a lot of good singing, a lot of music.

SW: Right.

FPB: And then it would fizzle away in a day or two after many conversion experience of some nature. We’re not in—we’re outside the mind or the emotions or that stable or that reliable. But real experience can trumps that and that’s a deeper thing where it moves you into a relationship with a divine being. I know Buddhist meditation, there’s not the sense of someone, some being where universal sense there but our experience as it is very pursuant and the ones that go deep enough, pass silence, pass stillness finds God, the center of being and it’s life being loved again when you are created. Because we all have to remember being created and pronounced whole and good and sent off. That’s where we’re trying to look because we remember that. So, when someone is really meditating or really connecting they started to feel loved again. That’s like way beautiful, really powerful; it’s frontal-lobe- destroying and emotion-crushing. It’s just huge. It’s really huge.

SW: Yeah. I get that because I was able to kind of direct my experience to a point where I ask to understand, where I directed to understand where all pains and suffering came from and I was able to come up with this whole mind model. Now that path has taken me down and working with psych PhDs and MITs, and GA tech. We’re working on the algorithms of human emotions for computers and it’s really cool stuff how you can–

FPB: Away from all that stuff.

SW: Yeah right. When you step away from all that whole process and you exist in that consciousness space, you can see how all this stuff works; all the mind works and how all the distractions and all that stuff works. It’s amazing. So that’s how you guys teach?

FPB: Yeah. We teach from experience and through their experience and then train them through spiritual exercises and meditations.

SW: Okay. Now, how’s the bible fit in through all of these? Because I understand that you guys–

FPB: Yeah we did teach the New Testament. Well, we know some of the Old Testament stories but those are not practical for us because there’s not much grace or forgiveness in those stories. Usually it’s—

SW: The wrath of God?

FPB: –the retribution, the falling of the covenant, the being weird, the being hammered and coming back into mercy, all that stuff, we don’t. That’s great but Jesus brought something to forgive karma. So, we teach the New Testament mostly and His life as an example. We say that His whole experience is inside of us and all the characters that He taught and all the people that He talked to are the way that He would talk to all the parts of ourselves. So, it becomes very like a dynamic thing as the Judas in us and the Mary Magdalene, there’s the Apostles and there’s the Samarian woman, you know, everybody. And demons are getting cast out inside of us. So the whole thing is the actions of Jesus and Mary working on us.

SW: Right. To me the New Testament especially like pre-enlightenment experience and post enlightenment experience, to me, was almost a whole new book. I read a totally different way and saw all of these different things flowering out of this thing that I thought that I have known previously. I really realized that I didn’t at that moment and I—

FPB: You know at a level. You know at the memorization level, or a story level but the application into you, that there’s a part of me that’s like lying but also claiming to be wonderfully astute to all the rules and doing the right thing you know. And wise Jesus yelling at that part of me. That’s weird, you know.

SW: That’s great.

FPB: That’s not the light but it’s the truth.

SW: Well, you know, I mean from my perspective, there’s a lot of Jesus in the New Testament that I now see that’s what kind of a, you know, for like for a better phrase here, there’s a lot of F-U inside kind of thrumming his nose at the entire world and it’s organization of how it does things and in comparison to the spiritual within that is not–

FPB: Very disrespectful.

SW: Yeah, disrespectful; not angry in a sense. Yeah, not evil or whatever but it’s kind of a–

FPB: It’s severe.

SW: Yeah, you guys are totally lost and you know, you need to be slapped in the face a little bit and to be awaken to what’s within.

FPB: One thing people don’t—they don’t prefer about Jesus is that He really don’t want to be, He didn’t care if He was liked. He didn’t care if He made enemies and to say the truth, He had to be on feathered by politics and He couldn’t be pleasing one group and another group. He had to just tell it like it was and it’s a tough thing but that’s what teachers do. They don’t really please people. You’d either love them or you hate them. You know?

SW: Yeah.

FPB: Pretty much. It’s front of the line.

SW: Well, you certainly know where you stand with people I guess.

FPB: Yeah.

SW: Now, how do you teach inside your organization? Do you lead people into meditation? Do you kind of shy them away from reading?

FPB: No. People read because it’s language to speak about your spiritual experiences. You need the language but we’re not great studiers because I don’t want it to become academics.

SW: Right.

FPB: You know a lot of educated people are in the order but did not for that reason not to be spiritual. We teach I guess in two ways. Like going inside in meditations, prayers and spiritual practice and then by the transmission of the priested teacher, they’re energy itself changes the energy of the room, changes the energy of the people. It’s like sitting–in the east they would sit with the teacher and meditate and the transmission of the teacher would change after ten years, may be you know? You sat, sat and sat.

SW: So there’s some kind of transmission. I saw a video that you did on YouTube, rather it was put up on YouTube where you did mention that there’s a great relationship between a teacher and a student that almost required.

FPB: Yeah, that’s definitely—it’s a love relationship, it’s a close. The relationship obedience really but dedication and there’s no funny business because that’s not teacher when if there’s funny business. But it’s where the person gets it from inside, somehow the student does that hanging around with this person or listening to this person can get them to the consciousness that they wanted. It’s teachers-student process. So, all of our people that grow have a priest or teacher that works with them.

SW: You see, in my experience when I had this whole thing I was by myself and was studying by myself but at the same time I was reading a book so you call D.T. Suzuki, a teacher of mine that lead me to meditation and how to meditate but then after that there was so much, I mean the experience shortly. There was so much that I didn’t understand that then I had to go out and read all these books and figure out how do I put this into context. What does all of this mean? I mean I feel like I just have a direct relationship experience with God where I would mesh with everything. And so, how do I put that all into? And just then that I started learning about all the eastern traditions and all of the, you know, Christian Mysticism and the different aspects of enlightenment that people put their different perspectives on.

FPB: My first teacher was a book. Well, most of us were. You know, like we would start feverously read the Yi Jing Book of Changes and I would cast the coins and it would give that very Chinese oriental advise and it really appealed to me and I really resonated to it and followed it and learned and studied it. It just took me about three or four years before I found all kinds of crazy esoteric books, you know, spirituality, Alice Bailey and Siddhartha and stuff that you often, you know, the eastern. That was huge for me. I think a lot of people would say that to verse that kind of reading list. Paramhansa Yogananda’s book, the Autobiography of a Yogi that’s what you’ll turn. I mean, we recommended that for everybody because it’s like all—

SW: It’s just a great read.

FPB: Yeah. And all of the stuff that—it’s pretty flaky that he actually runs into. You know the ego reasons why people develop their gifts and tame lions, you know that they tame lions and that comes really handy in most of our cities but—that was just a joke.

SW: Yeah, alright. What was your history before like when you were called? What were you doing before this? Did you run into an enlightenment experience or an awakening into Christ’s consciousness that you enter this life?

FPB: I had a few of those. I mean I’ve had an out-of-the-body experience when I was eight, two nights in a row. I’m right in the middle of the universe floating in the air, seeing stars and that was wonderful and then, of course I went to tell my mother that. She said it was the work of the devil so, that helped me a lot and gave me nightmares. She has been really awful. She’s a Catholic theologian so that probably explain. She’s really scholarly but later when I had the calling for the priesthood and that was really the time that I went into Benedict Monastery boarding school. They freak me out so much, the monks because they were scary and mean and alcoholic or lecherous or whatever. I saw a lot of skeletons in the bike death roads, so that’s really freaky. So I ran away from them; that’s when I went into eastern. For about five or six years, I guess I was 18 and a half I saw a vampire movie at a drive-in. The scene where Charlton has getting beaten up really badly and the train guy and Eunice has not really let him drink or eat because he was like woeful. And Jesus comes along with a wooden cup and all he sees is Jesus’ hand giving the cup of water, very clear and very beautiful water and that was me. All of the sudden I’m the guy that He was giving the water to, right under the movie I completely broken. I was just weeping most of the night. And I am not a weeper, you know that something I think but He used that movie to get to me.

SW: That’s beautiful.

FPB: Yeah that was a powerful thing. And I didn’t know what to do. Then, I read the New Testament the next day; the whole thing. I understood the stories but I didn’t understand the stories. You know what I mean? I don’t really understand the teachings but you know the stories because nobody taught me anything. Then I didn’t do anything for about a year and a half. And then I found my first teacher, Tommy. So, that was just Jesus moving me along in the tides.

SW: Kind of pushing you a little bit. ‘Okay take your next step.’

FPB: Right. ‘Now, you got get to a teacher. You’ve had a little bit of conversion experience and now you need a teacher.’

SW: Oh when the students are ready to teach your kids.

FPB: Right. You stop when the journal is ready. It’s the other way around.

SW: That’s great.

FPB: When you look at it.

SW: Do you have any kind of fringe connection to a larger truth? I know that like Richard Rohr for instance is seemingly enlighten master. I haven’t met him personally but I’ve heard him talking. He’s very filled with light. And they kind of put those folks over in a Franciscan order and that kind of thing. Do you guys have a–

FPB: No. We don’t come from that tradition. We’re really a new religious movement and even though we have roots in the early Christianity which is in the disciples you know, like teachers-student. We probably have some roots in new thought, signs of minds, Irenism and we really have some of our practices in meditations and initiations. That would be in Kundalini Yoga.

SW: Well, the truth comes from multiple locations all over the world and maybe multiple religions put their twist on it, like the Sufis of the Islamic traditions or the Judeans within Kabballah…

FPB: Zen in Buddhism.

SW: Yeah sure.

FPB: We’re in the mystical side of Christianity, so, the Mystics. Just like the SUKIs aren’t well-liked among the Muslims but they are also feared and respected because they are the mystics. Well, we are the ‘crazies’; the Christian Mystics as far as it. Like what do you do with them? What does the plan costal do with that?

SW: Right.

FPB: You know. Really.

SW: Yeah. How does that feel with what I’m reading in the Old Testaments and stuff like that?

FPB: Yeah.

SW: So, how do you guys—do you let folks come to you then?

FPB: Yeah. We put out a flier or we put something in the internet or of Facebook or something that can, Twitter and we’ll say what we’re doing and if they want to do that they can. I guess we’re not the best marketing people in the world, I wouldn’t say. I am terrible at it, personally.

SW: That’s how I found this show because I searched for Christian Mysticism and then found the center. And then I saw a movie night where they were filming or they wanted to do the screening of the film ‘I am,’ which I enjoyed.

FPB: That’s a good movie.

SW: Yeah, I really enjoyed that but that’s how I came in to say ‘hello.’ And I ‘m not really seeking so much anymore, so, I don’t attend regularly or drop in. I sent an email every now and then to say hi or you know, this opportunity which you get that–

FPB: Well, we support aren’t taught by us. That’s fine. It’s very, very cool.

SW: So, what would you say is the biggest challenge for seekers of truth in discovering that spark within? Would you say it’s kind of a pattern being wrapped in the mind so they couldn’t get out of the mind? Or is it like a patience issue? Because I ran into a bunch or different issues with folks getting frustrated sometimes because they’re looking within and they’d say ‘I don’t get it.’ What would you say in those types of folks?

FPB: Well, I think its two problems. The first one is our people are really looking for something that is life-changing or they’re looking for something that’s cool that they can acquire that’s put it on top of all the stuff they’re doing. Because the real path is not going to be for the putting it on top of, the real path would be because something is driving you to a deeper meaning and you don’t know how to do it and you’re humbly aware that you can do it alone, so then you’re looking for help. And that’s separates the secrets that you find essentially. Really it does because the finders are going to be the ones that can have experiences and they’re going to want them. The only way to get them is to let somebody lead you. So, that’s the second problem: can somebody lead you? Or can you trust anybody? Do people have funny motives? Yeah? Can people can be trusted? Mostly not. Are teachers virtuous? Mostly not. It depends on who you’re getting and that’s the interviewing process. People will have to do some interviewing preferably and find out who these people who are supposedly teaching. One would need a teacher from our point of view to get to these deeper experiences. Like having a distant teacher in the Himalayas, which you never met and you have to read their books, listen to their tapes. That’s not the same as somebody with you.

SW: Right. In the same room, interacting with you, conveying that energy.

FPB: Right. That’s transmission energy. You could only grow so far with that. So, we say teachers-student but who’s ready for that? You know, 5% of the people?

SW: Yeah.

FPB: It’s sad, you know. I’m being generous.

SW: Yeah, I think probably.

FPB: It’s 1% but I said 5% but it’s like 1. It’s probably five but it’s one.

SW: I saw you speak a little bit on YouTube on about the different types of awakening. Maybe we can cover that a little bit here.

FPB: Okay.

SW: Do you say—were there three types or?

FPB: I don’t remember.

SW: Okay.

FPB: What did I say?

SW: I mean it was like–

FPB: There were two videos that I put out. No? I’m kidding. That was just a joke. I think there’s the desire to grow and learn and see what else there is besides what we already know and that kind of gets you reading, I think. Reading and shopping and you know, reviewing and looking online and playing the different church video or whatever. And then there’s the kind of awakening the universe that you know something, that you want to know and so then, you’re a little bit more, maybe it’s desperate but serious anyway. Well, let’s say serious. And you’re willing to get help at that point. And there’s the aspect of that. Everybody is not humble. They just want to find something cool and then own it and possess it. That it’s theirs. That’s the ego still. That’s still ego attachment and all the same.

SW: Right. I remember story once that really struck home with me was that a master, I cannot remember the name of the master he’s an eastern master and a student came to him and said I want to be enlightened. He plunged him into the water, there was this stream. He plunged him into the water and held him down into there and the man was struggling, struggling and struggling. And he pulled him outright when the guy was about to pass out and he goes, ‘do you remember what it feels like how much you want that breath of air that you just took?’ He goes, ‘yes. Then, he goes, ‘if you want enlightenment that much come and see me.’

FPB: That’s a drastic story. Well, the US wouldn’t like that; it’s a little impolite.

SW: Yeah. To get the permit for the stream like that. And there are law suits.

FPB: Yeah. He needs a lawyer. He has to get a lawyer the whole thing. No. it is kind of serious like that. You know there’s the Bodhidharma story is like that. You know, he wanted to be taken into this Zen temple and it was in the middle of winter and the abbeys did not know. And he sat out in the cold and he’s freezing. After two weeks in the snow, he’s not getting some ‘no’ and so, he cuts off his right arm and brings it to the door and gets a tune and the teachers said ‘okay.’

SW: That’s pretty dramatic.

FPB: That’s way dramatic. It’s kind of like the drowning story.

SW: Yeah.

FPB: That’s pretty serious. It acts more subtly in reality; where you just don’t get to know until you let go of things. You may have to let go of your sense of control. It’s not specific. It’s not like ‘oh, you need to stop smoking.’ It’ nothing so ridiculous like that. You can’t get this consciousness by pushing and shoving, you can only get it by letting go. And the teacher just smiles waiting for you to let go and you can’t let go because you’re mad and then you’re mad at the teacher because they can give it to you. And so the teacher just smiles and waits for you to let go. And letting go is like ‘I give up. I really do give up. I really don’t know how to do this.’ and the teacher just ‘oh okay.’

SW: There you go.

FPB: Now, it counts. Yeah. I guess it’s more graceful and more subtle. Because we have rules of drowning people in a stream. Or like in Egypt, they put people in a sarcophagus and bury them for three days and that would be their initiation. They wouldn’t die. I mean, American Indians will go into a cave with snakes in the darkness and you couldn’t see and you have to face your fears. Well, those are pretty drastic. Damul may do those kinds of things.

SW: Right. Vision quest.

FPB: Yeah. Ours in more in regular life. We used the circumstances of the person’s own life to teach them. When they don’t want to just follow what the teachers says they let the circumstances do it. The teacher has many things that they can do without doing anything.

SW: Right. Because what really standing you do—from my perspective you can’t really enlightenment someone, they have to be able find it themselves. They just kind of–

FPB: Well the midwife, sort of. Midwifing them into the experience but they have to trust the teacher or it won’t happen. It can’t happen.

SW: Right. I mean I try to podcast all about enlightenment and spiritual enlightenment. Just kind of include people that that exists and that’s possible and hears the different disappointing story that people used to get attain it but at the same time I say ‘don’t believe a word that I say about anything. Save this one thing that it exists and that you can find it and that’s inside you.’

FPB: Yeah. Well, it’s within. That’s true. And so that’s the first scare thing that happens when people meditate. The first layer of doubt is that they are confronted with their own thoughts and then they know the Buddha theories they just blast them and send them on their way. You go deeper and now there’s this thing scaring you off from going deeper.

SW: Right.

FPB: There’s something deeper or why is it scaring you off. That’s the problem. And then, usually people quit and they just rather would do anything. They rather dance to music than meditate ever again because they’ve confronted this hard spot. But you need a teacher to know how to get through that to find God in the center. I mean God is within. Everybody goes ‘there’s no God.’ You know, like some of the eastern still calls ‘God.’ The Sufis do, the Kabbalist’s do, but the Zen go ‘no, there’s nothing.’

SW: Right.

FPB: But I did catch one movie ‘One.’ I don’t know if you saw it that but there’s one old Zen Buddha hanging all level teeth. And he’s smiling away and so happy and they ask him about his experience within and he says ‘when I go in I just see God.’ And I was thinking all of these other dudes are very serious like ‘all I do is lift a stone and I try to waddle across.’ And this guy is kind of like he’s in bliss and he sees God and he’s a Zen guy. That guy who knows. The others, they’re just thinking too much. Seriously.

SW: Yeah. Following your own doctrine, I mean–

FPB: Well, yeah, but that can be a sarcophagus, you can die in that doctrine.

SW: Yeah. And you see that a lot even in the practices. I mean there’s any imply there’s a unity movement. Right?

FPB: Yeah.

SW: It was based on the discovery of a couple enlightened people that passed their teachings down but then all of the sudden after a generation it started to transform into ‘this is what we believe and there’s a Christ within us.’ And they get the whole message but at the same time they don’t get it because they haven’t–

FPB: It’s a smiling cloak. Because of the smiling cloak. They do the dance but the ones that actually have any experience– and this true; we don’t have to institutionalize anything. And it gets old enough or big enough. It starts to get into like ‘this is what we do, these are the rules, and this is the structure.’ And you have a few now who might have an experience and the rest have a dutiful loyalty. And what do you do with that? I mean that’s a killer. That kills spirituality.

SW: Yeah because you don’t want to obey into that.

FPB: Yeah.

SW: When you get into that space, that’s the only thing that you have that’s linking you to Christ or God or whatever. You don’t want to give that up but at the same what do you replace it with.

FPB: Alright. My mother was just like a serious, severe Catholic, scared to death of how and the devil. Like how do you study that much and know so little.

SW: Yeah. When you think of what happened maybe in the mainstream Christianity from 2,000 years ago.

FPB: Yeah. We have been 2,500 times. We’re 36,000 denominations now in Christian.

SW: Wow.

FPB: I mean I’m sure one of them is wrong. No, I’m just kidding. They’re probably all right.

SW: Right.

FPB: Whatever. But that’s a lot. I think what happened is people just they latched onto one verse as they latched on to one style. One thing that moved them and then they ignored the rest. They definitely ignored teachers-student. Like discipleship. He said, ‘if you don’t do what I tell you to do, you are not my disciple.’ Now, who likes that? We are not a great teller-what-to-do country. This country doesn’t like to be told what to do in any level.

SW: Right.

FPB: You know?

SW: Yeah. A lot of folks who take that seriously and take that personally and that’s kind of devaluation of themselves to be able to say you know–

FPB: ‘I was obedient to this.’

SW: Yeah.

FPB: Yeah. That’s like humiliating. And yet those were the only ones that He called disciples is the ones that did exactly. He said ‘if you do what I command you.’ You know that takes a great deal of contrivance to command somebody and know what you’re saying and know what’s right for them to do. And also give them a freedom not to do it. That’s the teacher; the freedom not to do it.

SW: So that’s the organization does.

FPB: Pretty much.

SW: You just provide a teacher for the students who are ready and then they come to you because you’re marketing sucks.

FPB: Right. That’s right. And also we have a lot of people who like us and they come for inspiration but they are not interested in relationship. That’s a case group. That’s a support group.

SW: Yeah. And from my perspective, I think what you guys are doing is a lot more true to Jesus actual teachings than a lot of mainstream Christianity teaches. I mean there’s a lot of–

FPB: We have that feeling ourselves but we shouldn’t be saying that.

SW: No, I mean there’s a judgment that we’re not allowed to make because that comes from the mind and being in the enlightened space you devoid yourself of mind and simply are as everything is and be loving of everyone regardless what their attached to.

FPB: Oh yeah, I support for all life that’s necessary.

SW: Yeah, maybe you take it to the Janus standpoint to the way that you don’t step on hands or?

FPB: No. Just take it to my house and they’re on my terrain and then they should know better than that. I will absorb their crime, definitely. I mean, they can be outside where they belong.

SW: I like the way you put that. It’s over with raid or with a–

FPB: Whatever, thanks. Like the raccoon in my house. It’s not a friend .I’m sorry.

SW: You’re right.

FPB: It’s not a friend, he has to go.

SW: Yeah. That’s the way I kind of reason as well. If you’re inside the house you don’t belong here.

FPB: It’s my turf in here.

SW: Right. I know I moved in after you did but I built the house.

FPB: And then we get to find it later than you I don’t care, we’re in charge.

SW: Right.

FPB: We don’t support any cruelty or meanness.

SW: Yeah right. You value away but within reason. Now, the largest group in the United States at least that’s growing inside the religious community is Non-denominational Spiritual. They kind of moving away from, at least statistically speaking from pure research, they’re moving away from the organized religions and the mainline Catholicism, mainline Protestantism, mainline organized religion and moving into space somewhat more spiritual.

FPB: More universal too.

SW: Yeah. Universal certainly, more accepting. What would you say to those folks, I mean this I would certainly identified one organization that would be congruent with that type of mind set, but what would you say to those folks if they’re were not in the place where they could come see you guys, if they wanted to see you they could come see you guys what would you suggest as a path for them to explore and grow their spirituality?

FPB: We do have an online presence. I mean we have an online class that even people from other countries can get on and we see true classes online. The time is a problem because some people have to get up two in the morning for the class we have you know, in Australia or something like that. So that’s a little bit of concern but they get up for them so that works.

SW: Do you have any books that you might point people to?

FPB: Well, certainly Paramhansa Yogananda’s Autobiography of a Yogi is really good. Let’s see some more other books.

SW: Are you a fan of Eckhart Tolle or any of those guys?

FPB: Yeah, those are good. Even Caroline Myss for understanding things about energy and spirit, Mary Woodland books for psychology, Mallory Johnson books or psychology. He and she book really well.

SW: Are you a fan of kind of helping the mind move itself out of the way? Like understanding the mind to a better perspective so that we can–

FPB: Sure. I mean I was trained as a union analyst in Dream-Work for a year and I was a psychologist for years.

SW: Oh excellent.

FPB: So I do a lot that deeper psychological work of endurance and symbols and that kind of thing. Anything that get people more aware of themselves will do it.

SW: Yeah. I’ve got this whole thing that I’ve taught the Body Mind Spirit 101 online in the podcast and it basically taught the practical definition of the ego and the movements evaluation inside the ego depending where their source from caused different emotions and things like that. The number one rule is like obvious that if you can identify what’s going on within you, from in the mind standpoint you automatically bringing in a big thick curtain down in between you and what’s happening and you step away from it for a moment.

FPB: Good. And you start from there. Well, that’s what meditation does. They say it does increases the cortical cells by 15%. So, what I interpret that is as accomplished or practiced meditators they don’t react as emotional into situations because there’s a little bit of observing field where they can step back and wait and watch it and study it whereas people that don’t meditate they’re very volatile and react in fear, their fight or flight goes really fast within. If you can meditate you’re already practiced in observing before you leap onto the thing to hurt it or whatever the flight or fight thing does to the people. We teach all of that trying to sit down just works and different levels of exercise take people pass certain things. You know what we do. We worked a lot with lights and a lot with you. We do a lot of blessing with people and moving the light into their being and we visualize light a lot and working with their blessings and heals. Well, healing worked.

SW: Well, you guys give classes on Christian meditation right?

FPB: Yeah we do.

SW: Okay.

FPB: All the time. And we meditate every morning for half hour before doing anything in the service.

SW: That’s part of the practice?

FPB: Everybody does that.

SW: and now you guys do communion every day.

FPB: Every day.

SW: Wow.

FPB: Right after the half hour message.

SW: That’s pretty cool.

FPB: Yeah. And prayers every night. We have like—we’re pretty serious and we’re all professionals and we all have jobs except me. I don’t have a job anymore. Everybody else has a job.

SW: You have a job Sir.

FPB: Yes, I teach.

SW: To enlighten the world.

FPB: I teach. I still paint and do projects every now and then.

SW: Excellent. Excellent. Would you suggest that folks if they can get in touch with you guys? You know, initiate a program of meditating and things like that? I mean–

FPB: Yeah, you can get in touch with the priest in the centers in the cities. We’re online so they can contact them. And if it comes through me you tell me what city you’re on and I’ll tell you who to contact there.

SW: Excellent. From your experience and from your teaching, if they’re folks out there who are familiar with Christianity because I have a lot of friends who are familiar with Christianity, if they’re familiar with Christianity but they’re not familiar deeper truths that can be uncovered within what would you tell them to give them a hint to search for that or to search for more? What would you say to them to maybe spark that curiosity?

FPB: The inner teacher first of all. I mean you find somebody that who knows. There’s one that saying that Jesus says and find somebody who knows what this means. That’s what I’d say. He said ‘if you’re I’d be single, your whole body will be full of light.’ Now, you’re not going to find too many ministers to even ever quote that or even some of them said that’s not in the New Testament, when actually it is. Just like that ‘if you’re I’d be single’ meaning if you’re all of your attention in one point of this is become centered, your whole body will be filled with light, which is what happens in any kind of any meditation. And you’re that still that clear that there’s an explosion of light usually and it fills your body. Do if they can find somebody who knows what that means, they should study with them.

SW: Excellent. I’m sure if Father Peter knows what that means–

FPB: I do.

SW: And I kind of know what that means too but you know you guys know I’m crazy. So, thank you with this time today. I really appreciate sitting down with you because it’s so difficult to find folks who have really had an awakening experience that has lasted. You know, I mean it’s easier to find folks who had like some kind of drug-induced experience and ‘oh wow, I was one with the universe and everything is cool now’ yet they wrapped right back up into the ego and the trials and tribulations and they can’t figure out the issues in their life I and things like that. It’s really professional to be able to sit down with somebody who had an awakening and yet who can still stick with it and is willing to take the, what I call, becoming the Buddha and then shifting back into Bodhisattva, which is if you are a Buddha you want to go walk off into the woods be naked and eat whatever you can find and be alone for the rest for your life in bliss. But then the Bodhisattva says ‘well, that’s really not how the world works. The world works through money and trade and I need a job and would fight to help people to reach enlightenment or awakening then that’s awesome. I’m doing a better service to man than just being off and going alone.’ It is better to sit and talk with somebody who’s taken that path because I really respect that. I really respect that. So, I got to give you a hug. Thanks really.

FPB: Alright.

SW: So, if you guys want to check out the Christian Mystic movement, which is actually what I believe more in line in Christianity than mainstream Christianity is today. Where are the websites? How to contact you guys?

FPB: RuachCenter, R-U-A. Ruach means spirit- the Zen of spirit. R-U-A-C-H. That’s how they can all they want

SW: Okay. Great. Any Twitter addresses or anything like that that you want to share?

FPB: We did have some.


FPB: That’s another way to get to us.

SW: Okay. And is that a place where they can ask direct questions of you?

FPB: Yeah.

SW: Okay.

FPB: Definitely. I’m on YouTube and then I have 14 albums on iTunes and I also have seven books on Amazon so they can check that out.

SW: Wow.

FPB: Yeah.

SW: I didn’t know that.

FPB: Yeah.

SW: So yeah, you do have a job.

FPB: Yeah.

SW: Anything about enlightenment. Well, thank you again.

FPB: Thank you.

So, I thank Father Peter for that time that we took to bringing this interview. He took time out of his busy schedule to sit down and talked with me and for you guys. So, I appreciate his time on that. And again if you guys want to have any more follow-up and maybe say thanks to Father Peter for doing that interview, you can contact them through the RuachCEnter, R-U-A-C-H or you have a question for Father Peter regarding Christian Mysticism send it to or go to the website and you can contact him there.
Alright. I hope you guys having a great week if you want to pick up any of his books including an audio book about his life, you can do so at You can get a free audible book just for signing up for the free 30 days risk-free trial and you can cancel if you want but I have been a member for as it looks like for six years now. I said four previously but it goes back to 2006, which is an amazing amount of time for me to be subscribed to anything and I am only subscribed for that length because it is such a great value for me that the author reads the book to me. So, go check it out and you will be able to get a free book through Audible.

Okay . So, I hope you guys having a great week. We’ll be back next week; talk to you soon. Peace.



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